She 1 · Him 2 are Evan Nave (Lestat/PKS) and Cassie Bishop (Shy Moon), an Alternative Electronic duet from Cleveland, Ohio.
Interview conducted June 30, 2022
by Fan Locke
What is your upbringing?
Evan – Grew up and lived my whole life in Cleveland. Normal suburban stuff, but always a true geek. Oldest brother of four sisters.
How did you discover music?
Evan – My parents love music, so it was always around us as kids. My mother really turned me on to a lot of the music that I would grow to love the most, mainly funk and disco. That’s where I found David Bowie who showed me that being different is beautiful, not weird. My father wound up buying me Devo’s Freedom of Choice on a lark, and that’s where my true love of alternative music took off.
How did you start to write music?
Cassie – I started with an acoustic guitar in my bedroom and found it was a great emotional release to write about my feelings.
Evan – I was in a lot of cover bands through high school, but it wasn’t until the early days of Lestat that I began writing my own material. I loved that group writing exercise so much.
How did you get your first guitar, and do you still have it?
Cassie – My stepfather is an amazing guitar player and he got me my first guitar. I do still have it!
What is your guitar of choice now? Year, make and model?
Cassie – My favorite guitar is actually my Yahama acoustic. I’m not really an equipment junkie, but I like fender strats for electric.
How did your band form?
Cassie – Evan asked me if I would write lyrics and sing for his new electronic project.
Evan – Correct! I got the itch to start writing after putting Lestat down for a second time and taking a break from the industry, but I wanted to do something new and out of my comfort zone. I came across some of Cassie’s stuff online, and I’ve known her forever, so it just clicked. It’s been exciting watching her stretch herself as well, not having done a lot of purely electronic stuff before.
How did you get your bands name?
Cassie – Evan’s brain.
Evan – (laughs) Yes, that’s true as well! I was looking for something mathematical that could represent the two of us. She 1 Him 2 is perfect, because it can also be spoken as “She won, him too”, and I love that idea.
Describe your music.
Evan – I guess alternative dance is the best genre for us. Electronic dance music has so many subcategories. I’ve been in some niche bands in the past, and I think we have the most cross-appeal of anything I’ve ever been a part of.
What was your first performance at like?
Cassie – My first performance ever? At a local coffee shop when I was 16.
Evan – Wow, I think I was playing small parties in cover bands at that age. Not bad. So, we have yet to perform as She 1 · Him 2, but maybe someday. My first actual performance was at a club in Cleveland called the Nine of Clubs with Lestat. I was hooked immediately. I love performing.
Cassie if you look back 11 so years ago, you were on Cleveland.com website. You were part of what was called Fashion Flash. How do you think that article affect you to choose to go into the music business?
Cassie – I was already a performing musician when I did that article. I just thought it would be fun as I love fashion and currently work in the fashion industry.
Royalties never appear like magic. Royalties are only sent to you through work undertaken by a PRO to ensure that their members are getting paid. If you’re not yet signed up to a Performing Right Organization like ASCAP, BMI or SESAC, you may not be receiving all the royalties you deserve.
Do you belong to any to songwriters’ organizations like the International singer-songwriter association, SESAC, BMI or ASCAP ?
Evan – Yes, been a member of ASCAP for some time now. Both as a writer and a publisher.
What makes a good songwriter?
Evan – Lots of things! I would say writing is super personal, and if you get the chance to craft something from within then that makes you good. Now, success is a whole different thing. Writing that song or those songs that become things of legend is amazing, but since music is subjective it may not be good to everyone. You can be the sweetest peach in the bunch, but there will always be people who hate peaches.
What was the title of your first original song? Did you record it?
Cassie – I honestly can’t remember, and no, unfortunately.
Evan – Passing by Lestat. On the Theatre of the Vampires release. The original cut was 15 minutes long, but we got it down to 5.
What is the process of writing your music?
Evan – So, as it stands now, I’ve always done music first before lyrics and vocals. That being said, as Cassie is a skilled songwriter, I’ve asked her to write something for a future song that I can add music to. Always trying to stretch and learn with this project.
Why did you pick to redo David Bowie’s classic “Fame”?
Evan – I have very fond memories of dancing to that song with my mother in our living room growing up every night. She was a huge fan of Bowie, and Ziggy phase in particular. I’ve heard covers of it over the years, but none of them hit me right. With this project, and my desire to push myself, along with getting to work with a vocalist like Cassie who could add a cool new wrinkle on the song, I decided to go for it.
Have you heard any feedback from either David Bowie camp or his fans yet?
Evan – It’s been really interesting to watch the feedback. I knew this could be really divisive. Fame is well loved and Bowie is a legend. I really felt like we could do the song justice, and we had the right players to do it, including our producer, Mike Seifert. The response has been amazing. Mosly positive, with one or two exceptions, and I’ve seen footage of the track packing dancefloors, which is exciting. Nothing from the Bowie camp other than granting us the rights to do it.
What is your favorite track on your album?
Evan – Oof, this is always a tough question. It’s like picking a favorite kid, pardon the cliché. And all of our songs are so different, so I don’t know that I can.
How was it to work with Steven Seibold
Evan – Where things really got interesting is when it came time to cover the great guitar lines in the Fame, and every time I tried to recreate them electronically, I hated them. I’ve been friends with Steven Seibold from Hate Dept. for a long time, and I really admire his work. One night my wife convinced me to ask him if he would take part in the track and to my absolute surprise and excitement he said yes. When he sent me his tracks, I’m not going to lie, I got a little misty eyed. Steven is an amazing musician and an amazing human being in general.
What are you’re feeling about streaming music?
Cassie – It is definitely good for exposure and to find new music. I use streaming daily.
Evan – Yeah, if you’re a fan it’s great. As a musician, this is the way of things now. In Lestat, we went from making money on CDs, to breaking even with MP3s, to not making anything with streaming. I recently saw Tears for Fears and they put it best: “Please buy our music if you’d like us to make money. If you don’t want us to make money, then find us on streaming”.
The symbol # is known as the number sign, hash, pound sign and a sharp sign in music. The symbol has historically been used for a wide range of purposes Since 2007, widespread usage of the symbol to introduce metadata tags on social media platforms has led to such tags being known as “hashtags”, and from that, the symbol itself is sometimes called a hashtag.
Are people forgetting that the # is a part of music?
Evan – Of course! But internet shorthand has changed the meanings of so many things. This is just one of those things.
Digital vs. vinyl?
Cassie – Digital for me but to each their own.
Evan – I do have a soft spot for vinyl, having DJed for years in clubs with it, but there’s something so easy and clean with digital. I do appreciate the vinyl resurgence. I don’t get the cassette resurgence, though. Such a messy and clumsy medium.
What song from the past is in your mind right now? Moreover, what is the meaning that song means to you?
Evan – Tears for Fears’ Head over Heels is really in my mind right now, especially after seeing them live. It takes me back to my teens and early twenties in a way that no other song does.
If “Video Killed the Radio Star” do you think that the Covid-19 virus has killed live music? Do you feel the Covid-19 virus going to affect the music business in the future?
Evan – So, having been to a few shows lately, I can see that things are right back to or close to normal. I did appreciate the artists who did streaming shows, and I took a few of those in. It’ll be curious to see how COVID affects everything going forward, but I think things are pretty well normalized right now.
Do you think that Covid-19 has been a plus to an artist career?
Evan – Only from a writing standpoint. With no shows to play, I think a lot of artists have been writing a ton and we should start seeing that stuff blasting out if we haven’t already.
Cassie – I stopped performing but I did focus more on songwriting.
Evan – Exactly. We started collaborating right at the beginning of the pandemic.
During the pandemic you work on your music separate how was that. Including the videos?
Evan – It was…interesting. We did a lot of video chatting for sure. And since I wrote all the music first, I pretty much just handed it to Cassie to do the lyrical parts. Then she’d toss it back and I would help with arranging and adding any parts I might have. The videos were fun, but challenging as well. Mostly, one of us would record their parts and the other would try to match them. One of these days we’ll do one together! The only time we really saw each other was photo shoots and the studio.
What have you been doing with your self-quarantine?
Cassie – In addition to working on music with Evan, I released a solo album under the name Origami Moon called My Raw Heart, and worked on recording a duo music project I am in called Shy Moon. I also binged watched This is Us.
Evan – Yep, lots of TV and movies. I also have two kids and a wife who keep me busy. Bonus trivia, they are the model and children in our Fame video.
How do you stay healthy during the lockdown?
Cassie – Hiding from people and avoiding handshakes.
Evan – Staying distant from people and masking up.
Have you discovered or rediscovered any new hobbies?
Cassie – I started doing digital art for fun, which I really love.
Evan – I finally got around to sorting and cataloging my insanely large comic book collection. Something I should have been doing since I was a teenager!
Live Nation Entertainment – the corporate parent of Ticketmaster and a dominant force in the entertainment industry was able to get many of the funds which were met for smaller Venuses. Because these venues were not able to get access to these funds. Many of them went out of business still protected.
Live Nation as a parent company did not directly receive any money from the program, but the government relief to its subsidiaries still protected its investments and improved its long-term outlook, however slightly. The earnings of its subsidiaries provide Live Nation with crucial cash flow and enable it to service its debt, it said in securities filings. The aid enabled the companies to pay staff and recover more quickly from the disruption, their executives said in interviews and emailed statements
In 2018 Live Nation purchased what it described at the time as a majority interest in Frank Productions, a Madison, Wis.-based concert venue promoter. Frank Productions’ operating company, Frank Productions Concerts LLC, received $10 million from the SBA grant program in July, the maximum amount possible. Both Frank Productions and Frank Productions Concerts are listed as Live Nation subsidiaries in the SEC filings.
Do you think it was fair for Live Nation to use their power within the lobbies of the congress to get money for their subsidiaries?
Evan – No, but it’s no surprise, really. There will always be people who know how to game the system.
How can bands keep their fans if they cannot play live in front of the fans and sell merchandise to them at the show?
Evan – So, I think that concerts are really getting back to normal, which is good. Unfortunately, you pretty mush have to live on the road these days to make money, as opposed to the past when you would tour to promote record sales. During COVID, I did attend a few live streamed concerts that I bought tickets for that were pretty good in the grand scheme of things.
Is pay to play still a thing? Now pay to play also means thinks like playlist on the internet and opening slots for a major band on tour.
Cassie – I don’t think bands should have to pay to play.
Evan – Oh, I agree. But this is the way of things now. It’s really no different from payola in the 50’s.
What about Holographic concerts in our living room?
Evan – That would definitely fit with our electronic nerd chic (laughs)!
In the past if a musician stop doing music they find a new career. For example David Lee Roth from Van Halen became a licensed EMT in NY for 6 years, San Spitz (guitarist for Anthrax) became a master watchmaker, Dee Snider (Twister Sister) voice over work for SpongeBob SquarePants.. If you can’t do music, what would you like to be doing?
Cassie – I’ve always done music on the side while working a full-time job.
Evan – Same, unless S1H2 makes it possible to do otherwise. I’d love to do voice over work someday, too.
What is your happy place?
Evan – On stage performing. Other than that, I love Toronto, Canada.
Cassie – Black Mountain, NC.
Red Hot Chili Peppers are about to sell their entire song catalog for $140 Million. In the past year a lot of musicians such as Stevie Nicks ($100 Million) , Bob Dylan (over $400 Million), Taylor Swift, Journey, Def Leppard, K.T. Tunstall, and Shakira have sold their catalog rights within the last year. Bob Dylan sold his entire catalog for a reported $300 million. Neil Young song 50 percent of his worldwide copyright and income interest in his 1,180-song catalogue to Hipnosis Songs Fund limited. Once you get to the age of about 70. Publishing is far more lucrative then the mechanical royalties paid to artist based on sales, airplay and streams. A good example of this is Michael Jackson brought the rights to the Beatles catalog in 1985. And in the late 80’s the Beatles Revolution appeared in a Nike commercial.
The lump sums being offered by publishing firms are more tax friendly concerning estate planning.
Do you think you would be willing to sale your back catalog if someone like Universal is will to buy everything, such as all the rights to all your songs?
Evan – Boy that’s a tough question. I feel like if the time is right, and you’re ready to let go of control, I don’t see an issue with it. The problem comes up when fans start seeing their favorite bands’ music in commercials for financial institutions or medicines. That get weird.
What is your feeling about TikTok? With Sony Music and Warner Music strucking an “expanded” global licensing agreement with Universal Music Group. Now that TikTok is now fully licensed by all three major record companies, will you start using TikTok more?
Cassie – I don’t use TikTok, but I think Evan does? I can’t handle anymore social media accounts than the ones I have.
Evan – I literally just started a TikTok account, but I haven’t done a deep dive into it yet. I do hear horror stories about how labels are forcing musicians to be viral, and that’s a shame. Sucks the fun out of content creation if you’re forced to do it. Our music is available on the platform, though.
Also TikTok is launching TikTok Radio, a full-time SiriusXM music channel.The station will be available is vehicles and as a streaming channel on the SiriusXM App, desktop, and all connected devices.
The station will be part of a new TikTok collaboration with SiriusXM and its subsidiary, Pandora, to jointly promote emerging talent. Do you think this platform could became a force in the future of streaming music?
Evan – It’s so hard to predict what will hit and what won’t Everyone thought Tidal would be the next big thing, but it’s mixed results. I suppose we’ll see.
Anything you would like to say in closing.
Evan – I really hope people enjoy this project as much as we are. It’s been a fun ride, and I really love scratching the geek itch of my teenage self musically. And working with Cassie is amazing, she has such a unique voice and look. Later this year, we’re dropping another track that might be the happiest, catchiest thing I’ve ever been a part of called Stuck Inside. Stay tuned!
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